anyway, ive used virtually every notable mouse in the past, my current collection consists of: - 2 microsoft intellimouse optical 1.1 steelseries mice - 1 logitech G1 (which im using now), great mouse, great sensor, lightweight
p.s. I dont like the new 3.0, although i have to agree the fact that it is lighter than the deathadder is a definite plus, the mouse itself feels really cheap (specially when compared to the original 3.0)
#5 I tried that first mouse at the computer store. I didn't feel anything special about it. It feels like any other computer mouse you could have found at school or work or that came with a computer. I think the WMO 1.1 would be the safer choice. It's been proven at the highest levels of competition.
And yeah I did. :) Except the Habu which I got after I told microsoft one of my 3.0's wasn't working anymore. (hint, hint!)
The only thing I don't like about the 3.0 is that I wish I had the option of higher dpi. I don't play strategy games but wouldn't you need higher dpi for today's higher in-game resolutions? I think 400 dpi is fine for 640x480 games like starcraft but wouldn't that be too slow for today's games? I imagine with resolutions like 1024x768 or higher 400 dpi would be too slow and put you at a competitive disadvantage.
#5 http://download.microsoft.com/download/c/.. Microsoft says 1.500 fps "only". I use a WMO atm. Once I used the mouse you mean in an online café. Compared to WMO it is uncomfortable, but I think that the depends from one to the other.
the new one's just recently came out therefore i doubt most people have touched them yet, just wondering how good they are. in either case im more than satisfied with my G1.
#8 actually, the most common mouse amongst top fps players is the intellimouse optical, and 9/10 times you will find that their ingame sensitivity is nearly half the default. as you should also know most top fps players play on 640x480 ingame (the main reason for this is distance, the closer you see something the faster you react to it, the problem is that lcds suck at low resolutions) therefore 1280x1024 which is the native lcd resultion is still fine. however, i have to agree that the 800 dpi is ideal (but no more! i hate that the market these days if flooded with junk that has 50buttons, a crappy sensor, and rediculous dpi)
Razer Deathadder and Microsoft IME 3.0(2006 version.
#12, the market these days has a lot of mice, but not all of them are bad... The Deathadder is widely acknowledged to have just about the best sensor on the market, and it certainly fits the description of a high DPI and fancy looking mouse.
#14 ive used the deathadder as well as virtually any other notable mouse other there, would be nice if you scrolled up...
the deathadder isn't "widely acknowledged" to have just about the best sensor on the market. infact, the deathadder does have the best sensor on the market. the avago 3688 sensor. this sensor outperforms any other as long as it is run @ 1000hertz and 1800dpi. (top players have overcome this problem by using 3/11 windows sens).
please realize there is a huge difference between 4000dpi and 1800dpi. there is also a huge difference between laser sensors that have a lower malfunction speed than 5+ year old mice, and optical sensors which are top of the line. considering the deathadder is famous for being more of a standard mouse (5 buttons, wired, optical etc.) i would not call it a fancy mouse in any respect, aside from the childish lights (which you can thankfully turn off via drivers). if the deathadder was lighter (same weight as the 3.0 or lighter) i would by far consider it the best mouse. weight, just like higher sensitivity, simply takes away reaction and precision.
fact: most new mice are garbage, specially those labeled as "gaming" mice, look at the lachesis, the sidewinder, the G9 etc.
#11 Holy sh!te, nice set of mouses you have there!
#12 I should have been more specific. In quake 3/4 circles, the wmo seems to be popular amongst the top players. I do agree the IO is one of the dominant ones in CS though.
#15 Do agree about the weight thing. The Habu is the same size and shape as the 3.0. It's a good mouse and I would be using that instead of the 3.0 if it weren't for the weight. The extra heft creates an undesirable momentum in your hand when you're moving your mouse quickly to aim.
i dont find the weight of the DA to be a problem, thats an opinion thing anyway.
and not all laser sensors are bad.
SS Ikari laser should theoretically outperform the deathadder, even though I would never buy it over the DA.
And the huge DPI numbers obvoiusly aren't intended for FPS players, they are intended for people playing Warcraft or things like that on giant widescreen monitors. If you have a big widescreen that natives at 1920x1080 or higher then the extra DPI is nice.
A bunch of mice/mouses I've tried with only the MX300, MX310, G5 and Krait being my friends'; and the 3 MS mouses my brother's... the rest I've owned/own :)
Microsoft Intellimouse Optical 1.1A Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 3.0 Microsoft Wheel Mouse Optical
Logitech MX510 (red) for a long time -> Razer Diamondback for like a year -> Razer DeathAdder for near a year -> SteelSeries Ikari Optical for a couple of weeks, didn't like it -> Razer DeathAdder since so DA = best ;)
And yes, you're right. I mean the older version. I don't know, if they placed the 9000 fps engine into the new one, but I don't think so. In terms of comfort I doubt there changed something.
I like my Wheel Mouse Optical primary one. Noticed quake players like the small mice.Like the WMO, Mx300, and G1. Know Cooler and Cypher used WMO. Maybe Cypher will change to the Salmosa.
My wmo feels lighter than my G1. When I use them but they both 80 grams on my scale. Guess it's the larger feet of the wmo
The Ikari has 3200 CPI(aka dpi) and supposedly should track better and faster than the Deathadder, according to its specs. Whether or not it does in reality is a different story.
#32 perhaps youre right, i have been wrong before about products i didnt care too much about, but if you do find out the paradox than lemme know :D
#33 based on what??? where are you getting your information from>>?! like i said ive used both the ikari laser as well as the deathadder for a substantial amount of time and that statement is definitely false. however, the point is, based on what are you getting your conclusion from???? i know the ikari has 3200dpi, that is why i brought up the convo with bullveyr... so what exactly are you getting at? are you suggesting that higher dpi = better tracking>? you do realize all dpi means is a higher default sensitivity??
when i say the deathadder @ 1000hertz / 1800dpi is the best mouse out there atm in terms of malfunction speed, i can provide supporting evidence as well as my own experience to credit this statement. so what i would like from you, is atleast some time of reference where you got the statement that the ikari laser cypress sensor surpasses the deathadders avago 3688 sensor. thats all i would like...
fact: deathadder surpasses ikari laser in terms of malfunction speed. yet, there is another aspect that has to be taken into account, the ikari laser has a somewhat flawed way of tracking to begin with. (its almost as if it were a 200dpi mouse blown up to 3200dpi)
if you draw a line in paint with a mouse that has no correction (intellimouse f.e.), you will not end up with a perfectly straight line
if you draw a line in paint with a mouse that has lots of correction (nzxt avatar f.e.), you will almost always end up with a perfectly straight line
if you draw a line in paint with the ikari laser, its all over the place, its as if the mouse was incapable of tracking small precise movements and just jumps around from a series of pixels to another series of pixels. here is a good demonstration of what i mean:
First off, the DA has a perfect control speed of 3.92 m/s, which is much more important than malfunction speed. If you have a malfunction speed of the speed of light but only perfect control of .5 m/s than you have a really crappy mouse.
according to the FPS labs review, the person who reviewed it couldn't get it to skip once, nor screw up in tracking at all.
Kim Rom himself said that the newest laser sensors will outdo optical sensors(although the deathadder is obviously the king of mice right now). Although DPI means nothing to us low sens gamers, there are players who use giant screens(i've known people who hook there computers up to 50 inch lcd's with HDMI cables to game) and if you have a screen that big the extra dpi is certainly worth it. Or imagine a mid sized lcd that has resolution at like 2560x whateverthehell it is. more dpi helps!
Tracking may have nothing to do with DPI, but that doesn't make DPI useless. The reviews claim the ikari is just as good as the deathadder in terms of performance.
BTW, your claim that the deathadder has a higher malfunction speed is garbage. As far as I know, the Esreality mousescore article is the ONLY time that someone has accurately tested all those mice, and he couldn't even accurately beyond 4.5 m/s, and the Deathadder malfunction speed tops at 4.4 m/s.
This is a huge speed that is pretty much impossible for anyone to reach, which only makes me further question your claim that you can "prove it". You can move your arm fast enough and measure accurately enough to prove that the Ikaris malfunction speed is lower than the DA?
I'm guessing not, which means you should have an article somewhere to back up that claim.
Mouse collection?
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/6/28/19..
anyway, ive used virtually every notable mouse in the past, my current collection consists of:
- 2 microsoft intellimouse optical 1.1 steelseries mice
- 1 logitech G1 (which im using now), great mouse, great sensor, lightweight
i was wondering about this mouse, it seems to be what im looking for.
- lightweight
- optical
- wired
- no crazy high dpi
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp..
here is the same mouse in white
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp..
anyone have it?
p.s. I dont like the new 3.0, although i have to agree the fact that it is lighter than the deathadder is a definite plus, the mouse itself feels really cheap (specially when compared to the original 3.0)
Logitech G1
Microsoft Intellimouse Optical 1.1 SS
Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 3.0
Microsoft Wheel Mouse Optical
And yeah I did. :) Except the Habu which I got after I told microsoft one of my 3.0's wasn't working anymore. (hint, hint!)
Microsoft says 1.500 fps "only". I use a WMO atm. Once I used the mouse you mean in an online café. Compared to WMO it is uncomfortable, but I think that the depends from one to the other.
http://www.sk-gaming.com/album/12041
http://www.sk-gaming.com/album/17478
i think youre confusing this mouse with the older version.
here is the older version, which i agree is not a good mouse.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp..
and here is the older version of the 500
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp..
the new one's just recently came out therefore i doubt most people have touched them yet, just wondering how good they are. in either case im more than satisfied with my G1.
#8
actually, the most common mouse amongst top fps players is the intellimouse optical, and 9/10 times you will find that their ingame sensitivity is nearly half the default. as you should also know most top fps players play on 640x480 ingame (the main reason for this is distance, the closer you see something the faster you react to it, the problem is that lcds suck at low resolutions) therefore 1280x1024 which is the native lcd resultion is still fine.
however, i have to agree that the 800 dpi is ideal (but no more! i hate that the market these days if flooded with junk that has 50buttons, a crappy sensor, and rediculous dpi)
#10 link doesnt work for me
Razer Deathadder
#12, the market these days has a lot of mice, but not all of them are bad...
The Deathadder is widely acknowledged to have just about the best sensor on the market, and it certainly fits the description of a high DPI and fancy looking mouse.
the deathadder isn't "widely acknowledged" to have just about the best sensor on the market.
infact, the deathadder does have the best sensor on the market. the avago 3688 sensor.
this sensor outperforms any other as long as it is run @ 1000hertz and 1800dpi.
(top players have overcome this problem by using 3/11 windows sens).
please realize there is a huge difference between 4000dpi and 1800dpi. there is also a huge difference between laser sensors that have a lower malfunction speed than 5+ year old mice, and optical sensors which are top of the line. considering the deathadder is famous for being more of a standard mouse (5 buttons, wired, optical etc.) i would not call it a fancy mouse in any respect, aside from the childish lights (which you can thankfully turn off via drivers). if the deathadder was lighter (same weight as the 3.0 or lighter) i would by far consider it the best mouse. weight, just like higher sensitivity, simply takes away reaction and precision.
fact: most new mice are garbage, specially those labeled as "gaming" mice, look at the lachesis, the sidewinder, the G9 etc.
ms intelli(new, dark grey)
#12 I should have been more specific. In quake 3/4 circles, the wmo seems to be popular amongst the top players. I do agree the IO is one of the dominant ones in CS though.
#15 Do agree about the weight thing. The Habu is the same size and shape as the 3.0. It's a good mouse and I would be using that instead of the 3.0 if it weren't for the weight. The extra heft creates an undesirable momentum in your hand when you're moving your mouse quickly to aim.
and not all laser sensors are bad.
SS Ikari laser should theoretically outperform the deathadder, even though I would never buy it over the DA.
And the huge DPI numbers obvoiusly aren't intended for FPS players, they are intended for people playing Warcraft or things like that on giant widescreen monitors. If you have a big widescreen that natives at 1920x1080 or higher then the extra DPI is nice.
the ss ikari outperforms the deathadder? wtf did you hear that???
ive owned both mice and youre smoking something weird.
edit:
and fyi, the laser sensor found in the ikari is the same as the one found in the g9, toolbag.
http://www.roccat.org/Products/Products/R..
razer DA(using), mx-510 red & blue, 518 & WMO
mine is : IE 1.1ss, IE 1.1, IE 3.0, krait
Microsoft Intellimouse Optical 1.1A
Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 3.0
Microsoft Wheel Mouse Optical
Logitech MX300
Logitech MX310
Logitech MX510 (red and blue)
Logitech MX518
Logitech G5 (both versions)
Razer Krait
Razer Diamondback
Razer Diamondback 3G
Razer DeathAdder
SteelSeries Ikari Optical
SteelSeries Ikari Laser
Logitech MX510 (red) for a long time ->
Razer Diamondback for like a year ->
Razer DeathAdder for near a year ->
SteelSeries Ikari Optical for a couple of weeks, didn't like it ->
Razer DeathAdder since so DA = best ;)
1 WMO
1 g9
1 g5
NEED:
deathadder
IME 3.0
:)
IMO
IME 3.0
MX300
MX510
G3
IME 3.0 SS
G1
ordered:
Salmosa
http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/..
And yes, you're right. I mean the older version. I don't know, if they placed the 9000 fps engine into the new one, but I don't think so. In terms of comfort I doubt there changed something.
*UPDATE* <3 Microsoft
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/documen..
My wmo feels lighter than my G1. When I use them but they both 80 grams on my scale. Guess it's the larger feet of the wmo
no, they don't use the same sensor
G9: Avago ADNS-6090
Ikari Laser: Cypress OviationONS I (CYONS1001U)
http://app.cypress.com/portal/server.pt?s..
taken from avago
"ADNS-6090 is a high performance optical navigation sensor designed for the professional gamer"
another thing, the 6090-1-2 series are 3000dpi
the g9 is 3200
From Avagos POV Laser is still optical, the only real difference is the usage off a Laser-Diode instead of a LED.
I haven't found a pic where you can read the number on the sensor, but as you can see in the link below it's an Avago Sensor and not from Cypress.
http://myego.cz/item/logitech-g9-rozebran..
Don't ask me how or why they "use" it with 3200 DPI but Roccat (Kone) and SteelSeries ("WoW Mouse") also do it.
I will try to find that out. :)
perhaps youre right, i have been wrong before about products i didnt care too much about, but if you do find out the paradox than lemme know :D
#33
based on what??? where are you getting your information from>>?!
like i said ive used both the ikari laser as well as the deathadder for a substantial amount of time and that statement is definitely false.
however, the point is, based on what are you getting your conclusion from????
i know the ikari has 3200dpi, that is why i brought up the convo with bullveyr...
so what exactly are you getting at? are you suggesting that higher dpi = better tracking>?
you do realize all dpi means is a higher default sensitivity??
when i say the deathadder @ 1000hertz / 1800dpi is the best mouse out there atm in terms of malfunction speed, i can provide supporting evidence as well as my own experience to credit this statement. so what i would like from you, is atleast some time of reference where you got the statement that the ikari laser cypress sensor surpasses the deathadders avago 3688 sensor. thats all i would like...
fact:
deathadder surpasses ikari laser in terms of malfunction speed.
yet, there is another aspect that has to be taken into account, the ikari laser has a somewhat flawed way of tracking to begin with. (its almost as if it were a 200dpi mouse blown up to 3200dpi)
if you draw a line in paint with a mouse that has no correction (intellimouse f.e.), you will not end up with a perfectly straight line
if you draw a line in paint with a mouse that has lots of correction (nzxt avatar f.e.), you will almost always end up with a perfectly straight line
if you draw a line in paint with the ikari laser, its all over the place, its as if the mouse was incapable of tracking small precise movements and just jumps around from a series of pixels to another series of pixels. here is a good demonstration of what i mean:
http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/09/18/revi..
G9's up to 65ips
Ikari's up to 50ips
Death Adder up to 120ips
3.0
g1
First off, the DA has a perfect control speed of 3.92 m/s, which is much more important than malfunction speed. If you have a malfunction speed of the speed of light but only perfect control of .5 m/s than you have a really crappy mouse.
http://www.esreality.com/?a=longpost&id=1..
Also, the Ikari Laser DOES NOT HAVE CORRECTION. And that is why you can't draw a straight line with it, as you already said.
http://www.fpslabs.com/reviews/mice/steel..
according to the FPS labs review, the person who reviewed it couldn't get it to skip once, nor screw up in tracking at all.
Kim Rom himself said that the newest laser sensors will outdo optical sensors(although the deathadder is obviously the king of mice right now). Although DPI means nothing to us low sens gamers, there are players who use giant screens(i've known people who hook there computers up to 50 inch lcd's with HDMI cables to game) and if you have a screen that big the extra dpi is certainly worth it. Or imagine a mid sized lcd that has resolution at like 2560x whateverthehell it is. more dpi helps!
Tracking may have nothing to do with DPI, but that doesn't make DPI useless. The reviews claim the ikari is just as good as the deathadder in terms of performance.
This is a huge speed that is pretty much impossible for anyone to reach, which only makes me further question your claim that you can "prove it". You can move your arm fast enough and measure accurately enough to prove that the Ikaris malfunction speed is lower than the DA?
I'm guessing not, which means you should have an article somewhere to back up that claim.
Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 3.0
Microsoft Interllimouse Explorer 3.0 SS
Logitech MX510
Logitech MX518
Logitech G5 (original)
Razer Krait
Razer DeathAdder
Razer DeathAdder CPL
SteelSeries Ikari Optical
SteelSeries Ikari Laser
currently using razer salmosa, and ordered a custom io 1.1 from dukeboss, should be here within a month :D
BTW, looks like I may be making another acquisition soon. I see something on eBay that is very rare. :O
#39 You have to post a pic of it, when you get it.
Microsoft 1.1
Microsoft 1.1ss
Logitech G3
Logitech 310
Logitech 510/518
Razer Diamondback
Razer Krait
Razer Copperhead
Razer DeathAdder
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