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At long last it is here. One of the most talked about and long awaited games ever, Team Fortress 2, is finally playable as a beta and we have our first look at this new take on an old classic. How does it compare to the original? What needs tweaks, and what works great. Jason and Oscar give you the 411.  Title: Team Fortress 2 Beta Genre: First Person Shooter Minimum Requirements: Click Here Gallery: Click Here Price: $49.95 Introduction Enter Team Fortress 2. Yes we know. Laugh it up. Its finally here... no really, we aren't kidding. The game often put in the same cabinet as Duke Nuke Foreverm as infamous vaporware is finally playable. Remember those old school videos? Unless you have been living under a rock you will probably know that the current version of the game looks nothing like that. Think Toy Story meets the Incredibles. About two weeks ago Valve announced a special surprise for Orange Box preorders; a playable beta of Team Fortress 2 three weeks before the Orange Box goes retail and is available on Steam. Team Fortress has gone through various incarnations from a version for Quake, Quakeworld, Quake 2, and then as Team Fortress Classic by Valve as a mod for the original Half-Life. And now its back with a sequel based on the Source Engine. Team Fortress 2 Jason: Its finally here Oscar. I know you were weren't a big FPS guy when the original was really popular but I myself have been chomping at the bit for this game ever since the early rumors of a sequel when Valve first bought out Team Fortress and I played Team Fortress Classic. So with today's discussion you readers will get both sides of the coin, a Team Fortress devotee, and someone new to the concept who wasn't around for the original (Team Fortress Classic). And while we are topic of the original TFC, the big appeal to me when I first played was the classes. At the time it was a totally new concept for an FPS. Sure other games allowed varied guns and skins; but even to this day few games offer the diversity in play styles that you can get with the 9 different classes. Each character can offer almost a totally different experience from movement speeds, weapons, in game advantages, etc. One thing that has really been improved class wise is the balance of each character. In the originals some characters were over powered, and some like the medic and pyro were pretty weak. TF2 helps remedy that situation giving new and improved weapons to various characters, and new skill sets like the medic's uber heal. What are your first impressions Oscar?
Oscar: Without a doubt I'm impressed by Valve Software and what they've accomplished with Team Fortress 2. From a technical standpoint, the Source Engine, despite the critiques, scales very well and is taken full advantage of with the stunning eye-candy and new visual effects.The attention to detail and visual design cues make the game easy to pickup and perfect for competitive play. From a pure game play point of view, I can now fully appreciate why this game has been in the back of gamers' minds for over half a decade: it's just too damn fun. Simply put, it's highly addictive. The technical game play rewards players for working as a team by the sheer satisfaction of beating your opponent. Having such a wide variety of classes keeps the easily bored entertained and provides an avenue for new players such as myself to jump in and start playing immediately. Have no idea how to work Engineer? Then start rolling heads with the Solider! Having recently dabbled with Insurgency: Modern Combat which also emphasizes class based combat, I can completely recommend Team Fortress 2 over Insurgency any day. It's all due to the fact that Valve emphasizes the communal shit-talking aspect of the FPS genre by glorifying kills and encouraging users to pit themselves against one another. By simply pointing out that you have a 'nemesis' after another player on the opposing team repeatedly kicks your ass on a map, or when you are blown up by a rocket and the game points to chunks of your leftover carcass with a cartoon bubble saying "This is your head!", Valve has given Team Fortress 2 the tools it needs to become a huge standalone game aside from the nostalgic factor that gamers have been salivating over ever since Valve announced the game. That being said, some design elements may not sit well with those who enjoyed countless hours of Team Fortress Classic. Jason does anything stand out that really bugs you?
Jason: The first uproar from the peanut gallery and the old school fans will most assuredly be the lack of grenades. Yes there are no grenades at this point in the game. And from the rumors I have heard this may not change even when it goes final. And with the hours and hours I have put into this game I have come realize that I prefer it this way. Why? For one there is no more massive grenade spam. Anyone who has played TFC can testify to the incredible amount of nade spam that is usually seen. It can be fun to employ yourself, but after some time it gets really old, really fast. Secondly, the lack of 'nades forces better team play. No longer does a demoman just rush to opposing side, take out all the sentry guns with his mirv and regular nades, and crush the defense by himself. It takes multiple classes to get the job done with an average to better defense being employed. A scout can't rush across the map, grenade away the sentry guns, cap the point. Scouts pretty much get owned by sentry guns now and they need back up when in place, either from a spy, or someone with some heavy fire power. All in all I think it balances out game play, and helps take out the randomness that grenades often created. When I first played TF2, that was my first thought; "wtf, no nades, terrible idea". But after hours of playing I really enjoy it. The other big topic floating around on the internet: is this game capable of being played competitively? I believe with a few minor tweaks that the answer is a resounding "yes". I am not too familiar with all the server side settings yet but I think a few things from the default config would need to be changed or taken in to consideration for league play. One being the respawn timer. I myself feel it is a bit long at times and should never be higher than 20 seconds. Another being the sudden death rules. Would leagues want to use this format, I don't know. I get a kick out of it as there is no "next time", so people play smarter and actually value their lives, yet at the same time it can promote too much camping. What potential do you see from Team Fortress 2 Oscar, could we see it at a competitive level some day? Page:
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Monday November 23 2009 | |||||
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User Comments
Scouts never had frag grenades.
god.. tfc2 !!! lost of fun on internet next few days/weeks/year !! :D
the game looks stunning and at first its fun trying out diffirent characters. After a while i got bored. Besides the scout the other characters move really slow. I found the game becoming repetetive. Sentries i think are too powerfull & where was demos mans dynamite i saw in the trailers?
maybe just not my kind of game
p.s anyone out there who runs a server take off the frickin respwn time delay. Or at least reduce it to less than 10 seconds, thx
I have seen exactly what you are mentioning. 3 medics on a heavy alternating uber chargers its nearly impossible to prevent them from capturing the point. It seems there should almost be a delay in the rate a sole person can uber charged.
For instance if you get ubercharged as a heavy you cant have another one for say 2-3 minutes plus or something.
But you also have to realize, like the penny arcade link shows, you have to drop the medic right away. If you 2+ medics coming in with a heavy, you better kill the non uber'd medic asap.
1. Could make a good competitive game, but I'd like to see an option to take out critical hits...seems a bit random when one grenade or one rocket is way more powerful than the rest. Also, the crit hits are more likely to happen if you've just killed a couple people or if you've killed a particular person enough to be a nemesis. It adds a kind of fun positive feedback loop for rewarding play in PUBs but I think its a little too random for competition.
2.2Fort might be one of the worst maps...it's cramped and oldschool in a bad way...get over the nostalgia and stop putting up 24/7 2Fort servers.
3. Hydro is one chokepoint fight after another...fighting in hallways gets lame. I like their concept for the map, but I'm not sure the map itself is all that great.
4. Gravelpit is my current fave. I'd like to see more maps like this where there are two "bombsites" to defend and then a third final one. Very fun map and IMO has more variety than hydro simply because there are more strategic options on both offense and defense.
5. Dustbowl seems to work well, too...although one of the setups forces the attacking team down a pretty tight choke point, gets clogged with bodies and would be even worse with FF on.
6. Well and Granary are the only two maps that have the same setup - capture all five points. They are fun, but it seems like relatively even matched teams go to tiebreaker a lot. It's really hard to get more than 3 points...and also once you get 3 points its also really hard for the other team to push back. Most of the time I play it on pubs with relatively even teams it gets locked at 3-2.
7. Sudden death just seems lame compared to regular play. On well and granary I think you should just give the point to the team with the most CPs. I'm not sure what to do other maps.
TF2 will probably appeal to certain players, like the way certain players play CSS vs. CS. I know most of my old TFC friends will try out TF2, but with these changes, I'm not sure how many hardcore or highly-skilled TFC players of old will find this version worth playing.
Although, I can't really say much since I haven't played it yet.
Critical Hits, limited movement options, excessive spam, simplistic combat/roles for most classes.
edit: fortress forever would make a hell of a lot more sense to play in leagues
TFC isn't the original. Quake Team Fortress was.
"One thing that has really been improved class wise is the balance of each character. In the originals some characters were over powered, and some like the medic and pyro were pretty weak."
Medic pretty weak? That Jason guy sounds like a scrub that wants to make us believe he's had some relevant Fortress experience. Medic was the best cap class (and above a lot others in direct combat, Super Shotgun + accurate gren1s more often than not proved themselves a close match for seasoned Soldiers) in Quake TF and easily "top-tier" in TFC. Only slightly slower than Scout, but had Concs and regular Grenades as well, so it could exploit its speed with the maneuverability concs provided and also be a pretty decent Sentry/Enemy harasser with the regular grenades. Could infect people, too, which is more of a pub perk, but still. In TFC, Gliding and some decent map knowledge made a good Medic almost too freaking useful.
Also, you can tell that Jason guy is trying to BS us when they say the Scout was able to kill Sentries:
"A scout can't rush across the map, grenade away the sentry guns, cap the point. "
Uh, wtf? I can only think of one class that gets MORE destroyed by Sentries than OG Scout, and that's the old Pyro (who played Pyro anyways?), since with Scout you can at least try to conc/bhop past them.
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